NumPy.org site map - tracking issue

[rgommers]

[InessaPawson]

The latest version of the site map is stored here: https://app.flowmapp.com/share/e1b61759a5f95f43d8907baedf42875d/sitemap/

[Shekharrajak]

The latest version of the site map is stored here: https://app.flowmapp.com/share/e1b61759a5f95f43d8907baedf42875d/sitemap/

This is looking nice. It would be great if you can write few points about the page and may be the existing working URL of the corresponding page in the labels. e.g. I didn't get the Array Computing page - means what will be the content there (I can't find the corresponding page in current site)

[InessaPawson]

Thank you for your feedback, @Shekharrajak! Yes, I'm currently working on including more info + content for each page. As far as linking to the existing working URLs most of the proposed is brand new to numpy.org.
“Array Computing” page is proposed in NEP 28 (numpy.org/neps/nep-0028-website-redesign.html). @rgommers would be the best person to answer any questions about it. I haven’t got to it just yet.:)

[rgommers]

That site map looks cool!

There some content I drafted for About Us, Community, Install and Learning at https://github.com/rgommers/numpy.org/tree/newsite-content/www

“Array Computing” page is proposed in NEP 28 (numpy.org/neps/nep-0028-website-redesign.html). @rgommers would be the best person to answer any questions about it.

This would have some general content about what array computing (i.e. computing with n-dimensional arrays, the core of what NumPy is about) and how NumPy fits into the whole ecosystem here and what related projects are. Have a look at "Integrates with existing projects" and "Powered by Dask" on https://dask.org/ to get an idea of the type of content I'm thinking about.

See also gh-44

[rgommers]

A few thoughts on the site map:

• Looks quite complete, I'm not missing anything important.
• Community Survey: running the survey is a time-limited thing, but publishing the results on this page sounds like a really nice idea
• Case Studies: would put that on the front page, or linked from front page via an image/summary
• Annual Reports: the BIDS grant reports can be a good start for that. Also links to the NumFOCUS annual reports. I'd rename it though, to avoid giving the impression or making the commitment that we will write an annual report (can't really do that right now)
• Tools and Libraries and Extensions could be merged, not sure what would go where otherwise.

[datapythonista]

We discussed with @rgommers that it'd be good for users to have the navigation somehow standardized among projects (mainly for users common to different projects).

You structure looks quite good to me, I like some of the ideas and I think we can adopt them.

But my feeling is that 8 items in the top navigation are too many. In pandas currently we have 4, and I don't think we should have many more. You can see them here: https://dev.pandas.io/ I see Dask having 6, and as a user I feel it starts making things a bit too complex. Do you have a prototype to see that structure implemented already?

[rgommers]

Do you have a prototype to see that structure implemented already?

Not yet; the outlines are starting to become visible in the newsite branch in this repo.

[rgommers]

But my feeling is that 8 items in the top navigation are too many. In pandas currently we have 4, and I don't think we should have many more. You can see them here: https://dev.pandas.io/ I see Dask having 6, and as a user I feel it starts making things a bit too complex.

Not so sure, I quite like the Dask site. It's still on the minimal side I think. https://jupyter.org/ and https://julialang.org/ have 8 in the menu bar, https://quantecon.org/ has 6, python.org has two menu bars with 6 entries in the top one and 7 in the bottom one.

So I think 6 is the absolute minimum we can get away with; anything in the 6-8 range is fine.

https://dev.pandas.io/ has 4 in the top bar, but then another set of navigation links under the install button, and more in the side bar. It looks quite a bit busier than the Dask site.

[datapythonista]

I think in pandas we like things a bit more minimalist, you can see it in the API. ;)

To focus a bit more the conversation, since the size of the nav bar seem to be a question of preference, I see that those should be non-controversial:

• Install
• Documentation
• Community
• Donate

Some of the differences are:

• About us at the top level: We don't have that much there yet, but I guess it can make sense for us. Just the blog, I think it belongs to the community in our case, since it'll be an aggregator of other blogs.
• Contribute: Do you have it at the top level to make it more visible, or do you think doesn't belong to Community (where we have it)?
• Learning: If I get it right, besides the tutorials, you'd have there a page with links to stackoverflow and discourse, and another for what we call ecosystem. I'd personally look for those two in community. Is any other project using this structure? I see Julia has a learning section, but I think only for tutorials
• I think if we wanted an equivalent of "Array computing" will be in the same ecosystem page. But I guess it's more important for you, and I think it's fine that we differ on that.

[rgommers]

Contribute: Do you have it at the top level to make it more visible, or do you think doesn't belong to Community (where we have it)?

Yes, I think this could be folded into Community, that would make sense. Visibility was a thought, but I didn't think all that hard about it.

Learning: If I get it right, besides the tutorials, you'd have there a page with links to stackoverflow and discourse, and another for what we call ecosystem. I'd personally look for those two in community. Is any other project using this structure? I see Julia has a learning section, but I think only for tutorials

I indeed like the way Julia does it. Tutorials, videos, books, courses, cheat sheets. There's enough scope there that I wouldn't just put it under Documentation.

Tools + Libraries/extensions --> Ecosystem does make sense to me. It's not clear that it needs to be under Learning, could also be under Community or, maybe best, on the main page like on https://julialang.org/.

About us at the top level: We don't have that much there yet, but I guess it can make sense for us. Just the blog, I think it belongs to the community in our case, since it'll be an aggregator of other blogs.

Jupyter has Donate under About Us. I like the way Jupyter does it. And now that I checked, that's how I wrote the content already: https://github.com/rgommers/numpy.org/blob/newsite-content/www/about.md

[InessaPawson]

A few thoughts on the site map:

• Looks quite complete, I'm not missing anything important.
• Community Survey: running the survey is a time-limited thing, but publishing the results on this page sounds like a really nice idea

Yes, that is exactly what I had in mind for the Community Survey page.

• Case Studies: would put that on the front page, or linked from front page via an image/summary

Makes a lot of sense!

• Annual Reports: the BIDS grant reports can be a good start for that. Also links to the NumFOCUS annual reports. I'd rename it though, to avoid giving the impression or making the commitment that we will write an annual report (can't really do that right now)

Instead of a separate page, let’s have sections on the Donate page linking to NumFocus and BIDS annual reports. @rgommers, what do you think?

• Tools and Libraries and Extensions could be merged, not sure what would go where otherwise.

Done!

[datapythonista]

Thanks @rgommers, good feedback.

I think something like this makes sense to me (and to you for what you say):

• Install
• Learning (probably a single page)
  • Tutorials
  • Videos
  • Books
  • Courses
  • Cheat sheets
• Documentation
  • User guide
  • API reference
  • Release notes
  • Older versions
  • ... (NEPs, f2py guide for NumPy...)
• Community
  • Blog
  • Ask a question (StackOverflow)
  • Discuss (Discourse)
  • Contributing
  • Code of conduct
  • Community survey
• About us
  • Our history
  • Ecosystem
  • Roadmap
  • Team
  • Sponsors
  • Citing pandas
  • Donate
• ... (Array computing for NumPy - NBViewer, JupyterHub, Widgets for Jupyter,...)

You'd have the Array computing in the top level too. And there are minor things like whether donate is in the top level or in about us (I think some extra money from having in the top level would be nice). Or the roadmap (you've got it in community, but I guess may make more sense in About us).

Is there anything that you would change?

[rgommers]

Annual Reports: the BIDS grant reports can be a good start for that. Also links to the NumFOCUS annual reports. I'd rename it though, to avoid giving the impression or making the commitment that we will write an annual report (can't really do that right now)

Instead of a separate page, let’s have sections on the Donate page linking to NumFocus and BIDS annual reports. @rgommers, what do you think?

Makes sense, let's do that.

You'd have the Array computing in the top level too. And there are minor things like whether donate is in the top level or in about us (I think some extra money from having in the top level would be nice). Or the roadmap (you've got it in community, but I guess may make more sense in About us).

Is there anything that you would change?

That looks pretty good. Only minor tweaks perhaps:

• Documentation will have some more things for us, like NEPs, f2py guide, and links to older versions of the docs
• Ecosystem: on front page rather than About Us
• Roadmap: not sure, perhaps linked from front page. About Us doesn't seem like the most obvious place.

[datapythonista]

Makes sense, we'll also have to link to older versions of the documentation. I added links to the home page, but I think having it under documentation also makes sense. I updated the tree with the sections specific to NumPy.

For the ecosystem and the roadmap, when you say having them in the front page, you mean in the home, like in the navigation we've got in the middle of dev.pandas.io? Not sure if About us is the best place, but I guess they should be in the navigation bar too. Don't you think so?